OPT NEW STEM 10/19正式进入公示!!!!!!!，准备好评论吧小伙伴们

jeff_xu001 发表于 2015-10-28 12:22
I will refer you to the news where US workers in Disney were displaced by H1b holders receiving lowe ...

"OPT students are generally paid at least equally as their American counterparts in Hi-tech companies, big or small in size", I know as much as you do about the opt, there is no prevailing wage requirement for opt. How  can it ensure "equal pay"? also for the H1b visa,the prevailing wage requirement is too low to offer any protection and the enforcement mechanism is too loose to prevent fraud

"Companies that hire OPT students would have to pay more resources in hiring them, are they any kind of charity organizations", you only need to pay for 380 dollars for opt application. If you then apply for H1b visa, then there will be thousands of dollars. But even it is thousands of dollars, for a company it is a penny compared to the economic gains by replacing a US worker earning 80k with a foreigner earning 60k.

"they do so due to the lack of sufficient supply of qualified domestic talents": this is again the talking point from lobbying group of Wall Street and Silicon Valley. United States graduated twice as many domestic students in STEM fields as the number of STEM jobs every year but US students in STEM fields cannot find any job because of the disastrous guest worker programs like OPT and H1b Visa.

"pls stop complaining and do some study in sharpening your competitive advantages! hardworking spirit is what makes US a great nation not protection": I never say hard working spirit is not important. The problem is not too much protection. The problem is too little protection for US workers. There is no way to compete no matter how hard US workers work if they are discriminated unfairly because of those guest worker programs

jeff_xu001 发表于 2015-10-28 12:22
I will refer you to the news where US workers in Disney were displaced by H1b holders receiving lowe ...

I would like to see provisions in the new OPT stem rule that define clearly a prevailing wage requirement that is high enough to protect US workers and also protect rights of international students.
If that is the case, I will have no problem about OPT or H1b visa.

Unfortunately, the words in the new rule aiming for US worker safeguard are too vague and too relaxed.
American people have already realized that the administration will never fulfill the promise of developing good regulations for US citizens and we will never be delusional.

That is why in the presidential race, there is a huge surge of outsiders like Donald Trump and Ben Carson.
The only way to fix the problem is to abolish the opt program and H1b completely and start from scratch!

johnM 发表于 2015-10-29 06:01
I would like to see provisions in the new OPT stem rule that define clearly a prevailing wage requ ...

I would like to see provisions in the new OPT stem rule that define clearly a prevailing wage requirement that is high enough to protect US workers and also protect rights of international students.
If that is the case, I will have no problem about OPT or H1b visa.

Great Point! I would like to see that too. What I disagree with is your suggestion to abolish OPT & H1B program and start it over from scratch! I'd like to see improvements such as  a prevailing wage requirement, and I do think there already is!  

jeff_xu001 发表于 2015-10-29 09:03
I would like to see provisions in the new OPT stem rule that define clearly a prevailing wage requ ...

你还和他废话什么。。。
我真不懂反移民都反到一亩三分地论坛上来了。。
楼主你在干什么。。。直接踢走让丫滚蛋啊

futao0007 发表于 2015-10-29 09:39
你还和他废话什么。。。
我真不懂反移民都反到一亩三分地论坛上来了。。
楼主你在干什么。。。直接踢走 ...

无所谓了，稍安勿躁：

他的价值就是提供我们一个思考的视角 to produce a productive comment

johnM 发表于 2015-10-28 10:23
Let me dispute your arguments:
"only native American should stay, all others should go back to wh ...

I assume you are chinese, how will you feel if Chinese government wants to take in an endless flood of
foreign guest workers from North korea, Vietnam or Mongolia?

to your point:
endless? limited in number, I guess. a. number of positions b. number of qualified candidates
any type of foreign guest workers? in fact, STEM, highly skilled workers in short supply only!

Pls be advised

另外， 地里的xdjm们，pls pay attention to johnM 的 arguments，有针对地写些comment  比vaguely support 有用！ 光说 strongly support 基本等于没写啥！

futao0007 发表于 2015-10-29 09:39
你还和他废话什么。。。
我真不懂反移民都反到一亩三分地论坛上来了。。
楼主你在干什么。。。直接踢走 ...

unfortunately I know a little about Chinese. You accuse me of "anti-immigration" while your arrogant attitude is exactly why there is such a strong anti-immigration voice arising in the United States.

Of course you can block me from this forum but the Washington Alliance of Technology Workers cannot be blocked. It will continue to file law suits against the OPT program(not just the stem rule but the whole thing as well as the H1b visa) up to the supreme court if necessary.

If you really want to let the United States welcome foreign students, do not always post comment such as "I support this rule" or "block those anti-immigration idiots", make meaningful comments about how to achieve a balance between interest of foreign students and US workers.

I also want to remind you that this OPT extension rule is part of Obama administration's illegal executive actions. In 2017, Obama will leave his office and the new president has no obligation to maintain this executive action. And if problems of OPT and H1b visa are not resolved, US public will not vote for any presidential candidate who favor illegal executive actions of Barack Obama

johnM 发表于 2015-10-29 11:02
unfortunately I know a little about Chinese. You accuse me of "anti-immigration" while your arroga ...

John do make sense in saying： If you really want to let the United States welcome foreign students, do not always post comment such as "I support this rule" or "block those anti-immigration idiots", make meaningful comments about how to achieve a balance between interest of foreign students and US workers.

good opponent makes us at least less stupid

jeff_xu001 发表于 2015-10-29 11:21
John do make sense in saying： If you really want to let the United States welcome foreign student ...

Thanks for being reasonable. When I initally posted, I did not expect any response and I did think I would be soon blocked by the forum.
However, as you are willing to engage a conversation, I think it will be a good opportunity to let Chinese students know how American people
really think and why ordinary American people with good hearts become so anti-immigration in recent years.

I say abolish H1b and OPT and start from scratch because American people have been fooled by so many times on immigration and have lost faith in immigration policies.

. ----We do not trust any "remedies" or "fixes" based on the current system.

Here are examples why we do not trust.
In 1986, Reagon administration propsed an amnesty program to give citizenships to illegal immigrants. American people were told as long as we passed
this amnesty plan, border will be secured and the problem of illegal immigration will be resolved. Then after almost 30 years, the border is not secured
and there are still 11 million illegal immigrations in the united states.

In 2008, the Bush administration, aided by lobbying groups of wall street and sillicon valley pushed through STEM OPT rule without any public notice.
It is said that this stem rule will help grow economy. And then what happend? We had an economic crisis in next year that causes 90 million Americans to lose their job.
Of course, you may dispute that STEM rule has nothing to do with the 2009 crisis, but what you see is how incompetent establishment politians in both parties were in their
immigration policies.


In 2013, Obama during a youtube interview, Obama said he is not an emperor and can only enforce immigration laws instead of creating immigration laws.
And then in 2014, Obama annoused his illegal immigration executive actions part of which is about the expansion of OPT program.
This executive action essentially created a separate immigration law. (a slap of face: obama one year said he is not the emperor to create laws)

I assume a lot of chinese students studying in the United States have some knowledge about US politics. Let me tell you why Democrats lost in 2014 mid-term election. That
election was viewed as a referendum on Obama's failed immigration policy which was designed only to benifit Wall Street and Sillicon Valley by those disastrous guest worker programs.


If nothing changes, US public will vote for anti-immigration far right politicans into white house and congress in 2016. Also a quick note, because the new OPT stem rule is part
of Obama's illegal immigration executive actions, Even if this opt stem new rule is finally implemented in Feb 2016,
do not expect it will last in an far right anti-immigrant president's term.

Even if the next president is Hillary Clinton or Jeb Bush or Marco Rubio, the congress will definitely be controlled by anti-immigrant senators and house representatives
from far right and far left.

One example, the current chairman of Judicial Committee in US Senate which is responsible for immigration issues is Senator Jeff Jessions. You can google him.
.google  иHe is a stauch anti-immigration hawk and he just won the reelection by a tidal wave in 2014 without any challenger.


Now you shall understand why US public is increasingly strong in anti-immigration voice and want to abolish every thing and start from scratch.


What you can do? Instead of blaming on americans as "anti immigration racists" and simply shouting "implement this rule", post some meaningful comments about problems in that OPT stem rule
. Χto at least alleviate anger among US public, do not seek jobs from those Indian outsourcing firms, ask your company to give you the same amount of payment as US employees,
and in this forum, do not advocate those advertisements of "schools" for students to register and receive CPT but they did not really take any significant coursework,
stop promoting agencies in this forum which aim to fake resumes for students to get admitted by US unversitis and/ or recruited by US companies.

Here is all what I would say, I hope you can promote the message to other chinese students in this forum so that people know what exactly is going on.

johnM 发表于 2015-10-29 11:53
Thanks for being reasonable. When I initally posted, I did not expect any response and I did think ...

whether you like it or not, John's postings are very informative and constructive. We should take his comments seriously. Yeah, we should know how American really think about the issue.

Simply out of curiosity, John, your Chinese seems pretty good, Chinese American?