一亩三分地

 找回密码 注册账号

扫描二维码登录本站

BBS
Offer多多
Salarytics
交友
Learn
Who's Hiring?
疫情动态
指尖新闻
Instant
客户端
微信公众号
扫码关注公众号
留学申请公众号
扫码关注留学申请公众号
Youtube频道
留学博客
关于我们
查看: 2675|回复: 44
收起左侧

[阅读] 【英文读书会/每日持续更新】跟我一起读战争与和平 Tolstoy with Me

[复制链接] |只看干货 |业余爱好
我的人缘0

升级   19.65%


分享帖子到朋友圈
Udolpho | 显示全部楼层 |阅读模式
本楼: 👍   100% (7)
 
 
0% (0)   👎
全局: 👍   100% (557)
 
 
0% (0)    👎
本帖最后由 Udolpho 于 2020-6-10 09:48 编辑

疫情之下,因为宅在家,我最近看了不少杂七杂八的书(书单请看楼主单独发的推书帖子,有两个,在英语版块。)
我一直有想法做book club,现在终于找到了一本非常理想的书 -- 战争与和平。等下,先别急着走🤣。我一般也不爱看名著,这名字看起来就特别枯燥,但是,我以前也觉得傲慢与偏见这名字看起来特别枯燥,看了才发现这是言情界霸道总裁爱上我的鼻祖。战争与和平这本书大家应该也是从小就听说过了,作者大家也很熟悉了,是托尔斯泰 (Tolstoy),所以这个帖子叫做Tolstoy with Me。


我在疫情中看到不同的媒体推荐这本书,后来我就想着可以试试,不好看就弃书呗,也没什么大不了,kindle上这本书不要太便宜(也有免费版的,但是那个版本不推荐,关于译者我们之后会说一下),也不亏。开始看了以后竟然觉得非常吸引人,一点都不枯燥,我反而天天看得放不下来 (打脸现场)。这本书虽然很厚,但是每一章很短,几分钟就能看完一章,所以在看的时候并不觉得很辛苦。再加上情节曲折,人物刻画炉火纯青,战争场面壮大,舞会场面华丽,时间跨越十五年,空间横跨欧洲东西两头,真正是一场大戏。看书如看剧,吃瓜吃不停啊。


历时十天,我终于看完。这本厚得能当砖砸人的巨作让很多在艰难时刻中的人们找到安慰和希望。作者的叙述风趣幽默,不紧不慢,是在那个动荡年代中的一个不动摇的声音。所以我决定用这本书做媒介,来开始做读书会。我喜欢重复看书,尤其是很喜欢的书。这次是第二次看,会很慢很慢,想看看我第一次错过了什么,和第二次看是不是有不同的感想。大家可以跟着我的速度(这个速度大概会是三个月看完,所以每天真的读得很少,大概半个小时,大家不要有压力,我们慢慢来。千里之行,始于足下。我之前十天看完是因为我真的每天停不下来,好几个小时都在看🤣)。

形式:我会每天来贴更新笔记,全英文形式。笔记很短,就是我看的时候的一些想法。下面这个第一篇比较长,是我写的一个介绍和第一次读的感想,之后的都会比这个短很多。也很希望大家能跟帖一起分享读书的想法,问题,感慨(中英文都可以)。(就算没人跟帖我也会继续的🤣)



另外,我看的是Penguin Classics的版本,译者是Anthony Briggs。我也是纠结了几个版本,最后选择了这个,挺满意的。下面英文会具体说一下这个问题。


另另外,如果你想听语音的形式,我有个公众号,会发笔记和语音一起,可以当podcast来听。公众号的名字是“姐妹策米国”,里面也有很多关于工作和学习的干货。

There is always a certain aversiveness when we regard great literary works so critically acclaimed by many. Why, they were written long ago, in a time too distant from ours, by people who were long dead, and surely to bore us with phrases out of fashion and events out of touch. However, when we do find ourselves opening one of these volumes, we are always pleasantly surprised and would eventually reluctantly admit that those who came before us, be that the author of these writings or the readers, did have a point.

. From 1point 3acres bbs
War and Peace is such a volume. A hefty work of about 1,300 pages (the Penguin Classics version), this is not a book to be taken lightly (literally). Since the pandemic started, I came across recommendations on this book several times by different sources (among them is Yiyun Li’s virtual book club for War and Peace, which is the inspiration of this post, see https://apublicspace.org/news/detail/tolstoy-together), and in the end, I thought to myself: well, when would be a better time to pick this up than right now, when we’re locked up in our homes? Countless times I have heard of this book since teenage years. Hailed as one of the best books of all time, War and Peace was described as “epic”, compared to The Iliad, and its author Tolstoy easily recognized as one of the most influential figures in Russian literature. These praises didn’t move me to open the book. What did move me was reading A Gentleman in Moscow, a story about a has-been Russian aristocrat’s life confined in a luxury hotel in Moscow under house-arrest in the first half of the 20th century. I enjoyed reading this book immensely, and subsequently seeing Tolstoy and his works continuously mentioned in it I thought - one has to read it, and to know what all the fuss is about.


I started reading it at the end of May. It took me all of ten days to finish. And what a book! My first impression was that I couldn’t believe how funny and witty the language is. I didn’t know what to expect before I opened the book - I didn’t read the introduction because I didn’t want to be spoiled. I wanted to have a clean slate when I started, not knowing any of the characters or events, just jumping in cold (and I won’t say anything before you start either, so you can start with a clean slate as well!). But how funny he was! I smiled at the witty remarks he slipped in, you could almost see him winking at you, and you thought - yes, I see what you did there. Throughout the book, never once was I bored. The events, even the ones I knew of (since these were the ones that actually happened in history), I was eager to find out what happened and how it affected the characters. I was invested in all of the characters, major and minor. I wanted to know what their stories were, whether or not they would meet, and what kind of people they would eventually become. I liked the tone of his voice, it was always steady, whether in soirees or in battles, the way he told the story was always unhurried. I enjoyed the small bits of philosophy and history analysis he sprinkled in the story-telling. Far from making it dry, I think it enhanced the story as a whole, and made me think about the connections between the people in the story, the decisions they made, and the events that took place.


The book spans fifteen years between 1805 to 1820, and broad space from east to west, and what better experience to live vicariously through than this while we are all confined indoors? Therefore, dear reader, I invite you to read War and Peace with me and to see for yourself that the great classics need not to be boring or dry, but enticing, entertaining and enduring in the test of time.


What version to get:
Translations: I did some research on different translators of War and Peace. The one I read is the Penguin Classics version translated by Anthony Briggs. This is a more recent translation from 2005. I enjoyed this version very much and would recommend it to anybody. Other versions - Aylmer and Louise Maude translation: this couple worked with Tolstoy in translating his work and got his approval. The only shortcoming I heard about this one is that it can be clunky and doesn’t flow as well as the Briggs version. Another popular one is the Richard Pevear and Larissa Volokhonsky translation. Many people liked this one as well, but I heard some people struggled through it and it lost some of the magic in the original work - this of course is subjective. I don’t think you could go wrong in any of the translations, I have read multiple reviews that whatever the version you decide on, it will still be the same fascinating story.
Kindle v. Hardcopy: I read it the first time using Kindle. It helps because I can make the text super big, which was easier on my eyes. However I did miss the opportunity to be able to underscore certain passages and write in the margins. Highlighting in Kindle is never really the same for me. So I bought the hardcopy book as well, and this time, I will read the hardcopy (small text, but oh well), and make my notes.


How much to read each day:
One thing I liked a lot about this book, and maybe part of the reason I was able to get through it so quickly, is that each chapter is very short (it takes only a couple minutes to read one chapter, each average about only 5 pages). So instead of looking at this book as one colossal volume of 1,300+ pages, you can divide it up quite easily into very small pieces.


At the beginning of my every post, I will put what chapters I read. I will write a little bit of my notes to share with you. You can follow the same pace as me, or slow down/skip forward however you’d like. Since this is the second time I’m reading the book, I’m going to go very slowly this time, making notes and trying to reflect on things I might have missed the first time or changes in my impressions of some events/characters now that I know what will happen. I will not put any spoilers in the review, however. I’d love to have discussions/hear questions you have/share insights with you.


. check 1point3acres for more.


补充内容 (2020-6-17 11:20):
关于翻译,有别的楼主做了英译选段对比:https://www.1point3acres.com/bbs/thread-645005-1-1.html

补充内容 (2020-6-22 10:37):
( ̄ε(# ̄)☆╰╮( ̄▽ ̄///) 打脸来了:日更好难🤣 我会改成周更,不过一定会更完的(握拳)。是的我立了这个flag,请相信我🤣

本帖子中包含更多资源

您需要 登录 才可以下载或查看,没有帐号?注册账号

x

评分

参与人数 15大米 +89 收起 理由
SIL3NT + 1 很有用的信息!
lllmonster + 1 给你点个赞!
dddaisy + 2 给你点个赞!
pipichao + 3
zeta1 + 1 给你点个赞!
xzdxzd + 1 给你点个赞!
admin + 66
hahahax3 + 1 给你点个赞!
zuragh + 1 给你点个赞!感谢分享
DL + 3 给你点个赞!

查看全部评分


上一篇:求带着浓厚印度口音的听力资料
下一篇:reading/writing 14天打卡互助群
我的人缘0

升级   85.5%

本楼: 👍   100% (1)
 
 
0% (0)   👎
全局: 👍   90% (433)
 
 
9% (48)    👎
不能看俄文原版的有啥意思?还不如看中文的
回复

使用道具 举报

我的人缘0

升级   35.5%

awu80596918 2020-6-11 00:07:40 | 显示全部楼层
本楼: 👍   0% (0)
 
 
0% (0)   👎
全局: 👍   87% (7)
 
 
12% (1)    👎
嗷嗷! 积极响应号召。表示是今天开始读咩?(表示我最近被你种草的纯爱小说还没看完 wwww  都是在睡前看。看着看着就睡着了ww
回复

使用道具 举报

我的人缘0

升级   19.65%

本楼: 👍   0% (0)
 
 
0% (0)   👎
全局: 👍   100% (557)
 
 
0% (0)    👎
awu80596918 发表于 2020/06/11 00:07:40-baidu 1point3acres
嗷嗷! 积极响应号召。表示是今天开始读咩?(表示我最近被你种草的纯爱小说还没看完 wwww  都是在睡前看。看着看着就睡...
哈哈哈哈 那个也可以一起看 因为这个每天都时间会比较短。我明天开始更第一次笔记,第一次读Volume I, Part I, Chapter 1 - 3。加油!
回复

使用道具 举报

我的人缘0

升级   19.65%

 楼主| Udolpho 2020-6-12 00:15:00 | 显示全部楼层
本楼: 👍   0% (0)
 
 
0% (0)   👎
全局: 👍   100% (557)
 
 
0% (0)    👎
1 - Volume I, Part I, Chapter 1 - 3
. check 1point3acres for more.

The book starts in the middle of a conversation, and as a reader, it was like you walked into this room, and two people were talking, and you just caught them when the good bits were coming up.


The opening scene is a small party attended by the rich and famous (minus Pierre, who is neither rich nor famous, poor Pierre). This scene reminds me a little bit of Jane Austen when she wrote about the balls in Pride and Prejudice, although in hers was a gathering maybe less refined in terms of status in society. This is a party of princes and princesses, of foreign (French!) and supposedly very intelligent men and exquisite women. Everyone is putting on a show, propping up their persona and pretending to have a good time but mainly to show off whatever they prize the most (status, intelligence, or beauty). And what a host Anna Pavlovna is! Patrolling her drawing room putting out fires, preventing an awkward conversation before it even starts. She is truly...a selfless woman who devotes all her attention to the pleasure of her guests. And how she serves up her delicacies - AKA the viscount and the abbe! Like “a skilful head waiter” serves “a cut of beef” almost inedible if it was in a filthy kitchen - this line really made me laugh.


Enter Pierre - the only person who is so obviously different from all others. He is at the bottom of the hierarchy in terms of status (a bastard son), and he doesn’t know how to conduct himself at all. He is the only person who is entirely - himself. No pretense, because he is too naive to put on one and no tact, because he is too new to society to know the unspoken rules. He is fresh, silly and eager to participate. In my mind, I always saw him as a chubby, wide-eyed, boyish looking young man.


Enter Andrey - bored, arrogant, above everyone else. Handsome (but short). How he reminds me of Mr. Darcy! A study in contrast not only with his wife, but also with Pierre. When Pierre went up to him, I thought he would give him the cold shoulder, like how Darcy treated Mr. Collins. To my surprise, he smiled at him and changed his whole countenance! What a transformation, and they are friends! Imagine that. . From 1point 3acres bbs


Side note: You will notice that multiple characters were speaking French to each other. Throughout the book, there will be French phrases everywhere. French - the language, the fashion, the mannerism - were seen as a sign of status and good breeding. People conversed in French even after Russia was in War with France.

Quote of the day -
“Because of the self-confidence with which he had spoken, no one could tell whether what he had said was very clever or very stupid.”

Next time -
Volume I, Part I, Chapter 4 - 5






评分

参与人数 1大米 +3 收起 理由
DL + 3 给你点个赞!

查看全部评分

回复

使用道具 举报

我的人缘0

升级   19.65%

 楼主| Udolpho 2020-6-13 00:14:52 | 显示全部楼层
本楼: 👍   0% (0)
 
 
0% (0)   👎
全局: 👍   100% (557)
 
 
0% (0)    👎
2 - Volume I, Part I, Chapter 4 - 5. check 1point3acres for more.


An interesting scene between Princess Drubetskoy and Prince Vasily - this offers a glimpse into the personalities of these characters. The elderly princess uses everything she has (which is not very much) to beg, plead and flatter the prince into getting her son into the guards. The prince on the other hand, tries to brush her off. She eventually succeeds, and as soon as he leaves her face changes from smiling to coldness. She is somebody who sees a means to an end, and is not beneath using her method to get what she wants. We will see this trait in her again later on. Prince Vasily we already knew a little bit just from how he talks with our hostess Anna previously - he is conceited, cunning and arrogant. He sees his influence as “capital” and jealously guards it. This scene also reminds us how little society changed: to climb up the social ladder it sometimes matters not what we are capable of, but who we know.


We later see a discussion among the guests about Napoleon. From history we know that since the French Revolution, the elite class in the rest of Europe looks at Napoleon with suspicion. He was seen as a usurper of power. Pierre, however, thinks of him as a great man who preserved freedom and equality in France. Andrey sides with Pierre, but it’s hard to tell if he does so because he really thinks so, or because he considers Pierre a friend and therefore must back him up.


In this conversation we can see again how ignorant Pierre is of social rules when he interacts with people. He always says and does the wrong things - our hostess Anna keeps trying to stop him (“do you want to come to this other table?” She asked him twice, but he completely misses this signal.) He has “no idea how to enter a drawing-room and was worse still at withdrawing from one.” (插一句中文 - 这里Pierre真是情商为负的典范🤣)


On Andrey: how did he end up with the little princess? She seems shallow, and she likes attention. Andrey on the other hand seems to be blind to her beauty, does not pay her any attention, and seems to wish that she didn’t exist. It’s clear that he is not happy in his marriage. This again brings me back to Pride and Prejudice, and this time it’s Mr. and Mrs. Bennett. I imagine that they married more because of passion, he was drawn by her pretty face at first, but later found out beneath the pretty face there was an empty soul.


Quote of the day -

“If everybody fought for nothing but his own convictions, there wouldn’t be any wars.”

Next Time -

3 - Volume I, Part I, Chapter 6 - 10
回复

使用道具 举报

我的人缘0

升级   19.65%

 楼主| Udolpho 2020-6-14 01:01:15 | 显示全部楼层
本楼: 👍   0% (0)
 
 
0% (0)   👎
全局: 👍   100% (557)
 
 
0% (0)    👎
3 - Volume I, Part I, Chapter 6 - 10

Welcome to the misery of marriage. Andrey tries to persuade Pierre not to marry “until you can see her clearly”...he obviously didn’t see Liza clearly when he married her. Only in his conversation with his friend does he show his true self: not the lifeless, sarcastic, arrogant person we saw in the drawing-room, but excited, frustrated, yet full of life. He is disillusioned about women and marriage, and thinks that the best years are behind him. That is why he joins the army, as a way to escape family life.


From their interactions I can now see why they are friends. Pierre is the dreamer, and Andrey the doer. Each thinks the other better than himself, and therefore is drawn to him, as if drawing to an ideal that cannot be achieved.


It’s almost laughable how easily Pierre convinced himself that a promise doesn’t really need to be kept. We can relate - remember when you said you were gonna work out today but didn’t? Yup - it’s called “no self-control”.
-baidu 1point3acres

The party at Anatole’s - does it remind you of fret parties? Boys can be so stupid, somethings never change. Also - where did they get the bear? Am I the only one thinking about this question??


We find out about the rest of the night from gossips in the Rostov’s house (吃瓜群众们). I really enjoy reading about gossip among the characters, it is just like now how we follow celebrity scandals, we read about their misfortunes with a secret glee.


We meet a group of young characters - The Rostov siblings: Vera the oldest daughter, Nikolay the oldest brother, Natasha the girl full of life, Petya the youngest chubby child. Boris, the young guard officer, Nikolay’s childhood friend (he is also the son of the princess who was pleading with Prince Vasily), and Sonya the cousin, a girl like a kitten and obviously in love with Nikolay. Two of them struck me: Boris is handsome, and he knows it. Compared to Nikolay who is the same age, he seems more mature in a way that he knows how to act around adults. He also checks himself out in the mirror...maybe a sign of self-importance? Natasha - obviously the favorite of the family, care-free, probably always gets what she wants. Here is a quote that I think really embodies her personality - she “...flung her slender, bare arms right round his neck, and flicked her hair back with a toss of the head. Then she kissed him right on the lips.” I mean...you and I wouldn’t have done anything near that when we were 13. Such confidence! Such decisiveness! She will go far...this one...you go girl!


Quote of the day:
“Even in the very warmest, friendliest and simplest of relationships you need either flattery or praise in the way that you need grease to keep wheels turning.”


Next time:
Volume I, Part I, Chapter 11 - 14

回复

使用道具 举报

我的人缘0

升级   19.65%

 楼主| Udolpho 2020-6-15 00:54:13 | 显示全部楼层
本楼: 👍   0% (0)
 
 
0% (0)   👎
全局: 👍   100% (557)
 
 
0% (0)    👎
4 - Volume I, Part I, Chapter 11 - 14

It’s always interesting to see the differences between siblings - Vera and Natasha are two extremes. Vera is cold, scornful, holier-than-thou - overall not a likable person, but she is beautiful. Natasha on the other hand is sweet, naive, and does what she wants. I think the difference must have something to do with the mother’s affections - the co untess obviously favored Natasha a lot more and that is why she is the way she is. On a side note - in the previous chapters, Tolstoy mentioned that the Rostovs had 12 children, but in the book you will only see these four (Vera, Nikolay, Natasha and Petya). I assume all the other ones must have died...child mortality rate was very high back then. I actually googled this: child mortality rate in the 1800s in Russia, meaning the children who died before the age of 5, was about 43% (data from https://ourworldindata.org/). That means almost half of the kids born would not survive.


Pierre’s rich and distinguished father is mentioned again and we know that one of these days he will probably die and who is going to inherit the huge fortune? Anna Mikhaylovna thinks at least she and her son should get their share. You can again see how selfish she is - she thinks that the count is old and dying, and her son is young and just started his life, how unfair that the old should be rich and the young without anything? Her son should be entitled to have some money. This is the hateful logic of the selfish and self-serving.


Prince Vasily and Anna Mikhaylovna at Count Bezukhov’s house, like vultures circling the almost-dead, waiting to snatch at the victim as soon as they breathe their last. Is hypocrisy a sign of good breeding? They say such sweet and nice things with such abrasive tones to each other. All of them self-absorbed and completely insincere.


Boris meets with Pierre. Boris really tells it as it is - 3 blows to Pierre: 1. You don’t know me and don’t pretend you do; 2. We don’t care about politics in Moscow, we only care about gossip and currently we care about whether or not you will get your soon-to-be-dead father’s money; 3. I don’t want any of your money so leave off. Yeah Boris, way to lay your cards out.


This is hilarious:
- What makes you think he’ll leave us anything?
- Oh my dear! He is so rich, and we are so poor.
- That doesn’t seem enough reason, Momma.
Deadpan Boris is the best.

A note on Russian names: you will notice that Russian names usually consist of three parts, and sometimes they are referred to in the format of first + middle name: for example, Anna Mikhaylovna. Sometimes they are referred to by their last name, like Princess Drubetskoy. Her full name is Anna Mikhaylovna Drubetskoy. It can be confusing. At the end of the book there is a list of all major characters, you can use that as a reference. Once you’re used to it, it should be fine. I didn’t think it was a problem when I was reading it.



Quote of the Day -

“And Boris, with a great weight off his mind, having got himself out an awkward situation and put somebody else into one, became perfectly pleasant again.”
. 1point3acres
Next Time -

Volume I, Part I, Chapter 15 - 17
回复

使用道具 举报

我的人缘0

升级   10%

zuragh 2020-6-15 02:06:20 | 显示全部楼层
本楼: 👍   0% (0)
 
 
0% (0)   👎
全局: 👍   100% (15)
 
 
0% (0)    👎
wow好巧,我最近刚跟着A Public Space一起读完了。……PS:你读得好快啊!. check 1point3acres for more.
不过我用了Project Gutenberg上Maude的版本……的确能感到有些表达比较过时,读起来不顺畅。之后重读的话我希望读Briggs!
喜欢你post的形式,楼主加油啊~
回复

使用道具 举报

我的人缘0

升级   19.65%

 楼主| Udolpho 2020-6-15 03:53:44 | 显示全部楼层
本楼: 👍   0% (0)
 
 
0% (0)   👎
全局: 👍   100% (557)
 
 
0% (0)    👎
zuragh 发表于 2020-6-14 12:06
wow好巧,我最近刚跟着A Public Space一起读完了。……PS:你读得好快啊!
不过我用了Project Gutenberg上 ...

谢谢支持哈哈。真是好不容易盼来个人啊🤣
嗯对的我也是看到说maude读起来比较卡,所以就没有选那个。
我用kindle的时候没觉得,现在用纸质的版本做笔记之类的,真的觉得这个版本不错。后面的Notes和地图真的都很给力!尤其Notes里面一些背景科普我觉得还蛮重要的。我之前读的时候比较困惑的就是一个日期的问题,因为borodino那场战应该是九月才打,为什么书上说是八月底,后来看到notes才知道书里的日期用的是俄国的老历。
回复

使用道具 举报

我的人缘0

升级   10%

zuragh 2020-6-15 21:10:08 | 显示全部楼层
本楼: 👍   0% (0)
 
 
0% (0)   👎
全局: 👍   100% (15)
 
 
0% (0)    👎
Udolpho 发表于 2020-6-15 03:53
谢谢支持哈哈。真是好不容易盼来个人啊🤣
嗯对的我也是看到说maude读起来比较卡,所以就没有选那 ...

竟然!我完全没注意到😂打仗的行军路线啥的都有点一知半解。因为免费版本完全没有注释和背景科普,我就随缘读读了🤦‍♀️硬啃还是很吃力的……
读第一部分的时候差点跟不上,为此特地做了一张人物关系图,支撑我读下去hhh
回复

使用道具 举报

您需要登录后才可以回帖 登录 | 注册账号

本版积分规则

隐私提醒:
■为防止被骚扰甚至人肉,不要公开留微信等联系方式,请以论坛私信方式发送。
■特定版块可以超级匿名:https://pay.1point3acres.com/tools/thread
■其他版块匿名方法:http://www.1point3acres.com/bbs/thread-405991-1-1.html

手机版|||一亩三分地

Powered by Discuz! X3

© 2001-2013 Comsenz Inc. Design By HUXTeam

Some icons made by Freepik from flaticon.com

快速回复 返回顶部 返回列表